PACE President Theodoros Russopoulos: Trump could guide us toward a resolution for peace in Ukraine.

Regarding Europe's role in establishing peace in Ukraine, Donald Trump's peace plans, potential war freezes, lifting sanctions against Russia, and elections in Ukraine – read the interview with the President of the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe, Theodoros Russopoulos, conducted by RBK-Ukraine during the PACE session in Strasbourg.

The decisions of the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe (PACE) are always widely covered in Ukrainian media. However, they are predominantly reported in the format of "PACE called for," "PACE condemned," "PACE emphasized," and similar phrases. Indeed, this organization cannot force member states to take actions or, for example, coordinate military aid allocation.

Nevertheless, resolutions and debates in PACE, along with unofficial communication with its delegates—parliamentarians from across Europe—provide a valuable opportunity to gauge the average "temperature" of European politics. This is especially relevant in current times when the victory of Donald Trump in the U.S. presidential elections has stirred the world and Europe in particular, leading to more intense discussions about peace negotiations regarding the Russian-Ukrainian war than ever before.

Today, PACE will hold debates on the role of Europe in ensuring a just peace in Ukraine, which is precisely the focus of RBK-Ukraine's conversation with PACE President Theodoros Russopoulos, whose mandate was extended for another year earlier this week.

In his position, Russopoulos remains quite cautious in his phrasing; for example, he is reluctant to publicly advise Ukraine on whether it should make concessions to Russia during negotiations. The PACE President clearly has a deep appreciation for history, often referencing past events in his responses to RBK-Ukraine's questions, drawing from his own extensive political experience and meetings with Vladimir Putin over twenty years ago, as well as the ancient history of his own country, Greece.

Among other things, Russopoulos reminds us that the Council of Europe became the only institution of its kind in the world that managed to expel an aggressor country from its ranks following the onset of a full-scale war.

– On Thursday, the Assembly will hold urgent debates on the topic "Europe's Commitment to a Just and Lasting Peace in Ukraine." What role do you see for Europe in achieving a just peace in Ukraine in these times and under these conditions?

– This requires a very detailed answer, but I will try to condense it as much as possible. This question indirectly concerns what Europe should do in this new world. Unfortunately, I believe that Europe has lost many of its positions, not just due to aggressive war, but overall – in recent years, Europe has lost many of its positions that defined Western civilization as we know it. Politically or financially, I think Europe no longer holds the power it once did.

My first disappointment as a pro-European, which I have identified with for as long as I can remember, came during the economic crisis. Instead of having a mechanism to counter the economic crisis, we asked the IMF to come and save us. That was the first disappointment.

Later, we established a certain mechanism, and I believe we are much better prepared now if a new economic crisis arises. On the other hand, what happened with the onset of Russia's aggressive war against Ukraine has united Europeans, and that is evident. There are some exceptions, but I believe that if not all, then the overwhelming majority of people and certainly the overwhelming majority of governments in Europe support Ukraine.

The second question is what is happening with the war itself? What will happen next? Will anything change now due to Mr. Trump, etc.? Let me say that this institution, and especially this Assembly, is very proud to be the first and only assembly and institution in the world that expelled the Russians.

I was there. I followed all the discussions from the very beginning and am very proud to have been one of those who voted. At that time, it was a unanimous vote. Even if some member states decided to leave the Assembly and not vote. But even so, those who were there made this decision unanimously.

Secondly, I come from a country that supports (Ukraine, - ed.), and I can proudly say that it was my country that was the first to be warned by some Russian Foreign Ministry representative: "beware, Greeks, because you will be next." That was exactly the phrase. And this indicates that the person who leads Russia, with whom I have met many times in the past when he was a minister, is indeed a dictator. He has a worldview that is abhorrent and contradicts what this institution stands for.

Thirdly, I want to point out that from the very first days, I have been in close contact with my colleagues from Ukraine. I have been corresponding with them. There is no need to share what I told them. What I have publicly stated here on any occasion, whenever I had the opportunity to speak as a parliamentarian, is that we must be prepared because war has many phases.

The first phase is the shock we are all experiencing. The second is the reaction. We want to react, and we are aggressive in that reaction; we are doing well because this is war. But what concerns me the most is the third phase, which I have discussed with most of my colleagues from Ukraine – people start to see it as normal. When people think it's normal, they stop caring. And we have seen this. In the first days, the first weeks, the first months, this (war, - ed.) was on the front pages of the news. But then sometimes we cannot find out what is happening in Ukraine. Yet the war continues. Sometimes we learn about what is happening in Ukraine because (I am not talking about this institution, I am talking about ordinary people in Europe) the government decides to provide Ukraine with some equipment, some ammunition.

Then we have some opponents of that decision who are aggressively questioning why we are participating in the war, etc. and so forth.

Then Mr. Trump comes along, and everything becomes the media's top priority again because they are interested in what will happen after Mr. Trump's election, whether he will play a decisive role in ending this war, etc. So I do not know if I answered your question, but this is a global view of what I think about Europe, which, even if it is weaker than in the past, can still play a certain role.

We have given the so-called "light of civilization" to the rest of the world. And this institution has stood firm during the toughest times and expelled those who were the aggressors and started the war. Peace must prevail, territories must return to Ukraine and its people, and we can return to a normal life.

Will that happen? I don't know; you can ask me later, but I fear that the world is still divided, but no longer as it was before. Now the Chinese are more involved than before. In the past, they were always a significant part of the world.

– You are referring to the Cold War era, right?

– Yes. Back then, they were not isolated, but they were on the sidelines. And even with the USSR, they did not have good relations.

– In your answer, you mentioned several important aspects. First, as everyone has noticed, in recent months, and especially in recent weeks, there has been a lot of talk about some form of peace negotiations. But do you really see any substantial grounds for all these discussions?

– As far as I remember, and correct me if I'm wrong, even in the early days of the aggressive war, we had certain peace negotiations between the two countries. So who would be against peace negotiations? The question is, what does "peace" mean?

If peace means that the war will end but everything remains as it is now, and the territories seized by the neighboring country will become part of Russia, then this is not the peace we would want to support or hear about. Of course, peace negotiations are generally a good thing, and someone might say: if we do not negotiate, how will we know the outcomes of those negotiations? So, in principle, yes, but we must establish our boundaries, our red lines, as they say, for what this peace is for.

– You also mentioned Donald Trump, who might change the game for the whole world, particularly regarding the war in Ukraine. Do you really believe that his victory will have a significant impact on Ukraine's future, the future of the war, and the future of peace? And do you believe that the so-called "100-day plan," which is widely discussed, can indeed be agreed upon by all parties and start to be implemented?

– It was December 2003, I believe. Shimon Peres, the late president of Israel, visited Greece. At that time, he was not president; he had been foreign minister and prime minister many times. We hosted him in the office of our party's political group. We were in opposition, and I was the opposition representative sitting next to the president of my party. Shimon Peres asked the president: "What about the polls?" And the president said, "Theodoros will tell you," because it was my responsibility to communicate.

I told him that the polls were very